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> Mosque to go up near N York's ground zero
Rob
Posted: May 20 2010, 04:49 AM
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I would reckon that any announcement that there is a mosque to be built anywhere where there is a connection to be made to 9/11 is sure to ratchet up the publicity of the proposal and bring it to the fore.

I would reckon that there would be plenty of people wondering why, "of all the places that could have been chosen for this center, why here and why now?"

I need to read more to be able to comment in more detail. Maybe later.
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Sunny
Posted: May 20 2010, 08:33 AM
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I would think that putting a mosque so close to ground zero would be a little insensitive to those who survived or lost loved ones. I mean, you just wouldn't do it would you?
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nannham
Posted: May 20 2010, 02:53 PM
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Here is a current article from BBC on the topic,

New York mosque plan stirs up 9/11 memories

Wednesday, 19 May 2010
By Matthew Price
BBC News, New York

The site of a planned Islamic centre is two blocks from the Ground Zero site.
It doesn't take long to walk from Ground Zero to the old, crumbling Burlington Coat Factory on Park Place. Two or three minutes at most.

QUOTE

From the outside it doesn't look like much. Paint peels from the walls. An old, iron fire escape zig-zags up the outside of the building.
At the front door a sharply dressed man, in a black suit, white shirt, black tie, ushers in the worshippers. Men to the right, women to the left.
For now, this former clothing shop is a makeshift mosque, a place of worship for lower Manhattan's rapidly growing Muslim population.
If plans to develop the site go ahead however, within five years it will be a landmark Islamic cultural centre, a celebration - in the minds of its backers - of the religion ..

(excerpt)

Mike Burke's brother - a fireman - was one of the almost 3,000 who died as the World Trade Center's towers collapsed.
Mr Burke says families of 9/11 victims do not want a mosque by Ground Zero
Mr Burke wears badges commemorating the event on the lapels of his denim jacket.
It is not Islamaphobia, he insists - it's just that he and others do not want an Islamic institution nearby.

"I think the first concern for the families is that the religious beliefs of the terrorists who struck is going to have such a prominent place right around the corner from Ground Zero," he says.

"This is not an… anti-Muslim effort. It is understandably… emotional for them to be suddenly told that around the corner from where their loved ones were killed they're going to put a mosque."

(excerpt)

For some this has become a useful chance to voice popular fears about Islam.  Charles Wolf says it would be wrong to prevent the building of a mosque.
One group that says its aim is to defend freedom of speech against what it calls "Islamic supremacist intimidation" is arranging a rally at Ground Zero in protest at the plans.
Many wholeheartedly reject such a stance. Among them is Charles Wolf, an energetic man who has been heavily involved in the discussions over what should be built at Ground Zero in place of the Twin Towers.

He says many of the victim's families - like him - believe the Islamic centre should be built ..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/us_and_canada/10127563.stm


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Sunny
Posted: May 20 2010, 03:15 PM
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mmmmm... well now I'm confused. I guess there are two ways of looking at everything and both have many pros and cons.
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King Llyr
Posted: May 20 2010, 06:18 PM
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I don't know what the laws and rules are with council in the U.S.A or N.Y but here is Aust a public notice is listed, including direct contact with building owners surrounding the project site, to seek a yes or no for the project, if more this than that the project is stopped by law.


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Aussie
Posted: May 20 2010, 08:43 PM
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Come on. I know this is sensitive, but let's not get precious. Would it be okay if I opened a model aeroplane shop there?
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King Llyr
Posted: May 20 2010, 08:47 PM
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Understanding that point Aussie, but wouldn't the allowing of a mosque so close to the site give them the ability to laugh and wave a flag in victory, although this may not be the case at all, there is that concern.


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Rob
Posted: May 21 2010, 08:33 PM
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I am sure it will give some additional ammo to the tea party (aka teabaggers)...I am sure it should not be long before the connection is made between this proposed mosque development and the middle name of the current president of the United States...
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mohamed
Posted: May 27 2010, 03:07 AM
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QUOTE
NEW YORK – After hours of contentious public comment, a New York City community board voted late Tuesday to support a plan to build a mosque and cultural center near ground zero.

"It's a seed of peace," board member Rob Townley said. "We believe that this is significant step in the Muslim community to counteract the hate and fanaticism in the minority of the community."

The vote was 29-to-1 in favor of the plan, with 10 abstentions. The move by the Manhattan Community Board 1, while not necessary for the building's owners to move forward with the project, is seen as key to obtaining residents' support.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100526/ap_on_...und_zero_mosque


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King Llyr
Posted: May 29 2010, 07:12 PM
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Does this mean that N.Y now has to put up with 25 X 500 watts speakers bellowing out as though the mosque were on top a mountain to the valley below every 2 hours?


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Rob
Posted: May 29 2010, 08:01 PM
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@ King Llyr...

Wouldn't they have to comply with local ordinances related to noise [pollution].
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King Llyr
Posted: May 29 2010, 08:58 PM
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That would be as part of thier religious allowence, I don't think the councils could stop that.


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nannham
Posted: May 31 2010, 10:55 AM
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From what I understand, they are all clear on permits and the councils have approved it, and they intend to go ahead with the mosque, which will take about five years to build.

Here I have found an interesting article written by an educated American muslim, who is against the project,

QUOTE

Mosque unbecoming - not at Ground Zero

By M. ZUHDI JASSER
May 24, 2010

In the 1960s, my parents left their despotic motherland of Syria for the promise of genuine liberty and religious freedom in America. In the decades since, we have led the construction of a number of mosques in the towns where we lived.

Some went up without challenge from the local community, but others met with palpable local discontent. In those cases, the law and the natural American affinity for religious freedom eventually paved the way to the ribbon cutting.

These were all humble mosques, funded locally by our congregations. It's plain the planned "Ground Zero mosque" is something very different. Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, his wife, Daisy Khan, and an investor intend to build "Cordoba House," an ostentatious $100 million, 13-story Muslim community center including a gym, a swimming pool, a performance-arts facility and a mosque.

My first concern is whether the financing truly represents the local American Muslim community or comes with strings from foreign Islamists. But that is far from my last concern.

I am an American Muslim dedicated to defeating the ideology that fuels global Islamist terror -- political Islam.  And I don't see such a "center" actually fighting terrorism or being a very "positive" addition near Ground Zero, no matter how well intentioned.

To put it bluntly, Ground Zero is the one place in America where Muslims should think less about teaching Islam and "our good side" and more about being American and fulfilling our responsibilities to confront the ideology of our enemies ...

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedc...yGgz4ATF9v7cBDM


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King Llyr
Posted: May 31 2010, 11:45 AM
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So say us all, good on you Mr M. Zuhdi. Jasser.
It is my understanding that when a person or family leave the motherland to find a better place to live, they do it to get away from trouble, away from wars and death and dictatorships, why do they say that they are begining a new life in the new land yet contradict themselves and begin thinking as they did in the motherland, doing what they did in the motherland and wanting to over run everyone they approach?????????


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mohamed
Posted: Jul 22 2010, 05:16 PM
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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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King Llyr
Posted: Jul 23 2010, 06:52 PM
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In a news report just a few days ago, it was said,
The city will attempt to have the buildings and others like it placed in National heritage, to help make it much harder for a purchase and alterations.


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mohamed
Posted: Aug 15 2010, 12:04 AM
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Obama makes clear support for ground zero mosque

QUOTE
"As a citizen, and as president, I believe that Muslims have the same right to practice their religion as everyone else in this country," Obama told an intently listening crowd gathered at the White House Friday evening to observe the Islamic holy month of Ramadan.

"That includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in lower Manhattan, in accordance with local laws and ordinances," he said. "This is America, and our commitment to religious freedom must be unshakable."
QUOTE
Statement by the President on the Occasion of Ramadan

On behalf of the American people, Michelle and I want to extend our best wishes to Muslims in America and around the world. Ramadan Kareem.

Ramadan is a time when Muslims around the world reflect upon the wisdom and guidance that comes with faith, and the responsibility that human beings have to one another, and to God.  This is a time when families gather, friends host iftars, and meals are shared.  But Ramadan is also a time of intense devotion and reflection – a time when Muslims fast during the day and pray during the night; when Muslims provide support to others to advance opportunity and prosperity for people everywhere.  For all of us must remember that the world we want to build – and the changes that we want to make – must begin in our own hearts, and our own communities.

These rituals remind us of the principles that we hold in common, and Islam’s role in advancing justice, progress, tolerance, and the dignity of all human beings.   Ramadan is a celebration of a faith known for great diversity and racial equality.  And here in the United States, Ramadan is a reminder that Islam has always been part of America and that American Muslims have made extraordinary contributions to our country. And today, I want to extend my best wishes to the 1.5 billion Muslims around the world – and your families and friends – as you welcome the beginning of Ramadan.

I look forward to hosting an Iftar dinner celebrating Ramadan here at the White House later this week, and wish you a blessed month.

May God’s peace be upon you.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office...ccasion-ramadan


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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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mohamed
Posted: Aug 18 2010, 04:31 AM
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Keith Olbermann Special Comment: There Is No 'Ground Zero Mosque' - 08/16/10

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZpT2Muxoo0...layer_embedded#!

there are a lot of Americans that support the project but of course those aren't the ones that make the news

http://daryllang.com/blog/4421

QUOTE
Look at the photos. This neighborhood is not hallowed. The people who live and work here are not obsessed with 9/11. The blocks around Ground Zero are like every other hard-working neighborhood in New York, where Muslims are just another thread of the city fabric.


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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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nannham
Posted: Aug 18 2010, 12:43 PM
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President Obama says it's okay. They own the property and everything is legal. That's good enough for me. Freedom of religion in the United States is the American way.




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mohamed
Posted: Aug 20 2010, 12:37 AM
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Hi Nan, Its like i am collecting articles on that to get the big picture!

FACT CHECK: Islam already part of WTC neighborhood

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100818/ap_on_...sque_fact_check


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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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mohamed
Posted: Aug 20 2010, 07:57 PM
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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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mohamed
Posted: Aug 20 2010, 08:10 PM
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This isn't about Ground Zero - This is about America

Written by: Arshad Hasan

http://www.democracyforamerica.com/blog_po...s-about-america

QUOTE
Hallowed Principles and Hallowed Ground: The Case of the Islamic Community Center in NYC
The greatest tests of our nation’s resolve to defend freedom are not always on foreign battlefields. They frequently occur within our borders when we as a people are challenged to walk the talk of democracy and to unequivocally reject the voices of fear, intolerance, and hate.

Such is the challenge that has surfaced in the matter of the Islamic Community Center in New York City.

I have listened intently to the impassioned pleas of both sides of the argument. I understand the sources of their passionate appeals and the sensitivities related to the devastating events of September 11th, 2001. Indeed, I have had to look into my own soul to determine the balance between love and fear. I am appalled at those who have exploited the debate for their limited political interests. I have been in admiration of those who have nobly taken the high ground.

In the end, I have concluded that there can be no better affirmation of America’s values, no more spiritually uplifting testimonial to the citizens of other nations about our enduring commitment to tolerance and religious freedom -- and our abiding confidence in the durability of our principles -- than to welcome and support the Center.

I frankly cannot say better what two profiles in courage and integrity have articulated, and so I direct you, reader, to their words:

    * to Mayor Bloomberg’s August 3rd speech on religious tolerance at Governor’s Island (video at http://huff.to/9y2vs7; text at http://huff.to/bzRlBl).
    * to Fareed Zakaria’s August 6th commentary, in which he repudiates the unfortunate decision of the Anti-Defamation League to oppose the Center and announces the return of the League’s Hubert H. Humphrey First Amendment Freedoms Prize (http://bit.ly/9A7j9s).

The alternative is the perpetuation of the cycle of fear which yields no good.

http://standstoreason1.blogspot.com/


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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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King Llyr
Posted: Aug 26 2010, 01:56 AM
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It is reported that there are more than a dozen mosque in the New York area, why on earth is another one needed??????
Sure, freedom of religion as many say, but many would also say it is putting up a flag of victory,
as has been said, the germans cannot put up a german flag or swasticker in a jewish area, why should the mosque be allowed?


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nannham
Posted: Aug 26 2010, 01:03 PM
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KL, because the laws in the United States aren't the same. We are completely democratic and secular, and one of our freedoms is freedom of religion, any and all religions.

The laws at a local level have to do with zoning permits and city ordinances. If an individual or group purchases a property legally, and gets all the zoning permits in order, they are well within the law, and are allowed to build what they want on that property.

I have also read lately that muslims have already been using a room in the first floor of that former Burlington Coat Factory store as a makeshift mosque for years. No one has complained, and most people probably never even noticed that muslims have been going into that building to pray for so long.

Yes there are many other mosques in New York City, but a place to pray in that particular area would serve the local muslim residents.



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mohamed
Posted: Aug 26 2010, 07:04 PM
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9/11 Families Applaud President Obama's Support of Religious Freedom

QUOTE
August 14th, 2010

New York, NY, Aug. 14 -- September 11th Families for Peaceful Tomorrows applauds President Barack Obama for his statement in support of the building of a mosque near Ground Zero. On that day, members of our organization paid the ultimate price. We lost loved ones in the tragic attacks, attacks perpetrated by criminals. Our losses will never be redeemed; our wounds will never fully heal. On 9/11/2001 while many of us buried our loved ones we also took heart in our nation's principles and our rule of law. Ours is a nation that fights for religious freedom. Many of us who call ourselves Americans do so because we came to escape religious persecution in other lands.

We applaud President Obama for his leadership on this issue. Simply put:
we lost our family members on 9/11/2001, but will not lose our nation, too. America, the concept and the people and the land thrive when we chose to trust in our principles rather than cave to our basest fears.

What better place for healing, reconciliation and understanding than Ground Zero? We honor our family members by practicing American principles and moving forward from Ground Zero to a future of peaceful coexist

http://www.peacefultomorrows.org/article.php?id=986



On that day, members of our organization paid the ultimate price. We lost loved ones in the tragic attacks, attacks perpetrated by criminals. Our losses will never be redeemed; our wounds will never fully heal. On 9/11/2001 while many of us buried our loved ones we also took heart in our nation's principles and our rule of law. Ours is a nation that fights for religious freedom. Many of us who call ourselves Americans do so because we came to escape religious persecution in other lands.


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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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Aussie
Posted: Aug 26 2010, 07:22 PM
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Pearl Harbour is teeming with Japanese tourists. I went there in about 1984, and I did the Harbour Tour on a Tourist vessel which covered all the National USA Shrines.

The vast majority on board were Japanese.



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mohamed
Posted: Aug 28 2010, 12:04 AM
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"O ye who believe, be steadfast in the cause of Allah, and bear witness in equity and let not a people's enmity toward you incite you to act otherwise than with justice. Be always just, that is closest to righteousness. Be ever mindful of your duty to Allah. Surely, Allah is aware of what you do." (Quran Ch. 5, verse 9).

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Sunny
Posted: Aug 31 2010, 09:17 AM
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I watched a program the other week and it said that the main purpose of the building is a community centre. Only 10% is intended to be used for religious purposes.
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